Ptech

Thank you BDD, for demonstrating yet again the small, obedient and closed mind of the average True Believer.

Hold on tight, amigo, to your illusions.

bdd1

Translation: "It doesn't matter if the 'evidence' I cite to prove my point is wrong... Just pay attention to my point!"

__________________
extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence!

This is Khan he's tough and ruthless!
This is Quan he's rough and toothless.
(a fist full of yen)

Denie

Mahdiadi wasn't there the morning of 9/11!! My God!! The smoking gun!!

Scraping the barrel now!!

Denie

From the Badillo article: "As they were making there way up the floors, Firefighter Schroeder heard a huge explosion. 'The elevators just blew right out. We couldn’t believe it. The plane hits 80 floors up but the elevators explode at least five minutes later? It was unreal.' "

At 5:50 in the Avery video, Schroeder: "We got our orders from the command post to team up with engine 5 and start our way up. So we're standing there in the lobby, we're getting all together. All of a sudden, we hear [makes sound of big explosion]. I look down to my right, and the elevator's exploded like something out of a Bruce Willis Die Hard movie. People just come running out of the elevators on fire. Fireball. I mean, it was like, what is going on here? Somethin's up here. I mean, the plane's up there, now there's fire down here? People running around all on fire? This is crazy."

I was surprised by this part of Schroeder's account because none of the published accounts from people in the lobby describe this major event, nor does the Naudet footage that's been released capture it or its aftermath. I suspected that Schroeder was confusing the impact and fireball of flight 175 on the south tower (and resulting burns to people on the ground) with the preexisting elevator damage. It turns out that people who were with Schroeder do confirm an elevator falling at that time, although they don't mention a fireball or burned people coming from the elevator. They do mention – at that moment – the impact of flight 175 and the fireball it made outside the building.

Denie

A little background on the "srewloosechange" crowd by Mark Roberts



Some things you should know about the men
who interviewed you and their associates

Schroeder Letter– Home

Dylan Avery, writer and director of the conspiracy video Loose Change

To my knowledge, Avery has never gotten a significant claim about 9/11 right. He refuses to acknowledge corrections. He lies constantly. I do mean "lies," not "makes mistakes." He has a very serious problem with the truth.

Avery says the U.S. government and military committed the 9/11 attacks. He says Islamic terrorists weren't involved.

Avery says American flight 11 and United flight 175 did not hit the Twin Towers. He doesn't know what happened to those planes, although the remains of numerous victims from both planes were collected at the WTC and positively identified.

Avery says American flight 77 did not hit the Pentagon. He doesn't know what happened to that plane, although the remains of every victim but one were collected there and positively identified, along with the plane's flight data recorder and cockpit voice recorder.

Avery says United flight 93 did not crash in Pennsylvania after heroic passengers tried to storm the cockpit. He claims passenger Todd Beamer's "Let's roll" statement is government propaganda. He doesn't know what happened to that plane, although the remains of every victim was collected at the scene and positively identified, along with the plane's flight data recorder and cockpit voice recorder.

Avery says some of the victims on those flights may have been involved in the government "inside job" conspiracy.

Avery believes that WTC building 7 was brought down by explosives that no one heard. He denies the numerous FDNY accounts of the raging fires in that building. That means that all the Chiefs and firefighters who say that it collapsed because of the fires, and who determined that it was unsafe and saved many lives by pulling firefighters away from it, are liars.

Avery believes the thousands of people who investigated the crimes of 9/11 are liars or dupes.

I found 426 errors in Avery's video Loose Change, including 81 errors of fact. Loose Change contains 18 major claims, all of which I have shown to be false. Avery has not contested a single one of my corrections.

When a member of his internet forum announced that he had plans to murder me, rather than ban him from the site, Avery told the deranged person where and when I could be found.

At Ground Zero on 9/11/05, Avery told a 9/11 widow, "I want to be honest with you – our government killed your husband. Without a doubt." That encounter is included on the Loose Change Second Edition DVD.



Alex Jones, executive producer of Loose Change Final Cut

To my knowledge, Jones has never gotten a significant claim about 9/11 right. He refuses to acknowledge corrections. He lies constantly. I do mean "lies," not "makes mistakes."

Jones believes the thousands of people who investigated the crimes of 9/11 are liars or dupes.

Jones directly accuses the firefighters of conspiring with WTC 7 owner Larry Silverstein and the Port Authority to demolish that building on 9/11. From his websites:

Alex Jones' Prisonplanet.com: "Silverstein, FDNY Decided to Pull WTC 7"

Alex Jones’ Infowars.com: “World Trade Center Imploded by Silverstein, FDNY And Others”

Alex Jones' Infowars.com: “Update: People Died in WTC 7: This Makes Silverstein and the FDNY Guilty of AT LEAST Manslaughter" [by the way, no one died in WTC 7]

When I confronted Alex Jones at Ground Zero last September, he repeatedly lied and denied blaming the firefighters. That encounter is recorded on a video that's promoted by Dylan Avery and company. When I challenged him to go with me to Ten House to make his accusations, he said he wouldn't talk to me any more. In the same video where Jones tells these lies, he nastily harasses U.S. military personnel who are eating lunch and brags about running them off. Avery and co. are pleased about this and chose to include the scene in the video they promote.

At Ground Zero on 9/11/06, Jones said that the majority of FDNY firefighters are sympathetic to the claim that the 9/11 attacks were committed by the U.S. government and military, not by Islamic terrorists. That statement was promoted as the truth on his website.

Last week, Alex Jones started a web forum. I was one of the first people to register and post there. My post was about Jones' horrible accusations and lies about the firefighters. I was immediately banned from the website.



Jason Bermas, researcher for Loose Change Second Edition

To my knowledge, Bermas has never gotten a significant claim about 9/11 right. He refuses to acknowledge corrections. He lies constantly. (Actually, this last one is a tough call. There's the possibility that Bermas believes the crazy things he says, such as the Apollo missions being a hoax and the U.S. political elite practicing occult rituals.)

Bermas says the U.S. government and military committed the 9/11 attacks. He says Islamic terrorists weren't involved.

Bermas believes that WTC building 7 was brought down by explosives that no one heard. He denies the numerous FDNY accounts of the raging fires in that building. That means that all the Chiefs and firefighters who say that it collapsed because of the fires, and who determined that it was unsafe and saved many lives by pulling firefighters away from it, are liars.

Bermas believes the thousands of people who investigated the crimes of 9/11 are liars or dupes.

In a video promoted by the Loose Change creators, Bermas accuses the 9/11 firefighters of being "paid off" to keep silent about what killed their brothers. In what is perhaps the most insulting excuse and apology of this century, when confronted about his accusation Bermas wrote in the Loose Change blog that someone must have played a "Jedi mind trick" on him, and that he actually thinks the firefighters are being threatened to keep quiet about the "inside job." Oh, that's much better, Jason.

I'd like to know if Jason Bermas has run his "Firefighters were paid off/threatened to shut up" claim past these people: The Higgins family: Retired FDNY Captain Ed, FDNY firefighter brothers Joe, Mike, and Bob, and NYPD Sergeant Mike, whose son and brother Timothy died on 9/11; Lee Ielpi, one of the most decorated firefighters in FDNY history and his son, firefighter Brendan, whose son and brother Jonathan died on 9/11; Captain John Vigiano, whose firefighter sons John and Joseph died on 9/11; Jimmy Boyle, retired FDNY union president, whose firefighter son Michael died on 9/11; The Harrell family, whose firefighter brothers Stephen and Harvey died on 9/11; The Haskell family, whose firefighter brothers Thomas and Timothy died on 9/11; The Langone family, whose firefighter brothers Peter and Thomas died on 9/11; Chief Jim Riches, whose son James died on 9/11; Chief Eddie Schoales, whose son Thomas died on 9/11; Captain Bill Butler, whose son Jonathan died on 9/11; Battalion Chief Joe Pfeifer, whose brother Kevin died on 9/11; Lieutenant Dennis O'Berg, whose son Dennis died on 9/11; Lieutenant Paul Geidel, whose son Gary died on 9/11; Fire Patrolman Mike Angelini, whose firefighter brother Joseph and nephew Joseph Jr died on 9/11.

Because I expose his falsehoods and despicable behavior, Jason Bermas publicly accuses me of being a "traitor to my country and to humanity," although he has never once shown that I've gotten anything wrong.

You can watch two televised debates between me and Avery / Bermas here: Part 1/Part 2




Korey Rowe, producer of Loose Change Second Edition

Like the others, he says the U.S. government and military committed the 9/11 attacks, and that Islamic terrorists weren't involved.

To my knowledge, Rowe has never gotten a significant claim about 9/11 right. He refuses to acknowledge corrections, and in fact he has said that errors were deliberately left in Loose Change, a video that purports to tell the truth about 9/11.

When I met Rowe in December, he volunteered that he had never read the 9/11 Commission report. At that time he was making his living by claiming that the 9/11 Commission report is completely false.

Rowe believes the thousands of people who investigated the crimes of 9/11 are liars or dupes.

The FDNY engines and trucks have a decal across their windshields that says, "We support our troops." Korey Rowe was recently arrested on charges of deserting the U.S. Army and is now apparently being forced to rejoin his unit.


Of course, the Loose Change guys don't merely lie about 9/11 as so many in the "truth movement" do: they make their living at it. They are professional 9/11 liars.




Luke Rudkowski, leader of WeAreChange

To my knowledge, Rudkowski has never gotten a significant claim about 9/11 right. He refuses to acknowledge corrections. He lies constantly. I know, because I used to confront his group regularly on Saturdays at Ground Zero.

Until recently, he spent those Saturdays in the company of people who accuse the FDNY firefighters of horrible crimes and cover-ups of those crimes.

Rudkowski believes that the thousands of people who investigated the crimes of 9/11 are liars or dupes.

He accuses WTC landlord Larry Silverstein of terrible crimes, without a shred of evidence.

The main argument Rudkowski makes at Ground Zero on Saturdays is that the Twin Towers could not have collapsed the way the official version (the NIST report) states. However, over a six-month period he could never once state what the simple conclusions of that official version are. When I confronted him about this on camera, his excuse was, "I'm not a wizard." See that exchange here. Please keep in mind that this person constantly claims to care about the truth.

I asked this question of one of the Saturday Ground Zero protesters who accuses the firefighters of being criminals and liars: "So the Chief of Department, the top uniformed guy – do you think he knew about this demolition conspiracy and cover-up?"

Protester: "He would have to. You think something like this comes from the bottom? It comes from the top. Wake up, buddy! The fish stinks from the head down."

"Then why did Chief of Department Pete Ganci die here, along with the First Deputy Commissioner, the head Fire Marshal, and 22 Battalion Chiefs?"

I'm still waiting for answer to that one.

Now Rudkowski has his own group. He recently excitedly promoted an appearance at Ground Zero of a special guest: a man who has published dozens and dozens of articles in journals devoted to anti-Semitism, neo-Nazism, and Holocaust denial, and who is friends with one of the world's most notorious neo-Nazis. Nice, huh?


Manny Badillo, author of "9/11 Firefighter Sets the Historical Record Straight"
I don't know anything about Badillo except that his uncle died on 9/11. Because of that, he should know better than to treat you as he has. If he chooses to write again about 9/11, I'll be glad to assist him with his research.




Loose Change creators disparage people who gave millions to 9/11 victims

When they're not lying about 9/11, I'm glad to see that these people are finally trying to do some good by raising money to help with first responder health issues. I say "finally" because here's what Dylan Avery and Jason Bermas have publicly said about people who gave a lot of money to victims' causes:

On their radio show, Avery accused "United 93" director Paul Greengrass of not donating profits from that film to victims' causes. Bermas replied, "Of course he hasn't! Why would he? He's a scumbag."

At that time Universal Pictures had donated over $1.4 million to flight 93 victims' families.

Avery repeated that lie this year on his website when he was asked if he'd be donating any profits from Loose Change Final Cut to victims' causes: "We'll be donating more than michael moore, oliver stone and paul greengrass have donated to date, which is right now at approximately 0%."

At that time the creators of those films had donated over $4 million to 9/11 victims' causes.

I wonder if Alex Jones, the Loose Change Final Cut executive producer who accuses the 9/11 firefighters of lying about WTC 7's condition and destroying that building with explosives for a real estate developer, then engaging in a massive coverup, will allow Loose Change profits to be donated to the people he says are criminals. I wonder if Jason Bermas will argue against donations to the people he accuses of keeping quiet about what killed their brothers.

Ptech

Denie

I'm an amateur psychologist, and I was wondering if you would do me a favor?

Could you explain to me why a person would believe a government hack before he would believe a private citizen?

bdd1

just look in the mirror!

__________________
extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence!

This is Khan he's tough and ruthless!
This is Quan he's rough and toothless.
(a fist full of yen)

Ptech

BDD

It is hard to believe that anybody is as dumb as you appear to be.

Look in the mirror?

I don't believe the govt--YOU do. I will give benefit of the doubt to the private citizen, you do not.

bdd1

I will give the benefit of the doubt to the people who know what they're talking and have the evidence to back up their claims, not the bullshitters you respect so much!

__________________
extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence!

This is Khan he's tough and ruthless!
This is Quan he's rough and toothless.
(a fist full of yen)

Ptech

How do YOU know that any given person knows what he is talking about?

What if it is an area in which you have no expertise?