Originally Posted by itsmeeeeeee

Led by Boomer-aged women, the group, Clinton Supporters Count Too, is holding a press conference in Columbus at noon to release this statement.

Originally Posted by Insipid

Her campaign has been in now way abomminable. Obama would certainly think it irrational to not vote for Hillary should she get the nomination. He has said so on many occaisions. As far as their decision making process goes, other than the iraq war vote (of course Barack wasn't in the Senate for that decision) what major ways did they vote differently? Since Barack was in the Senate their votes have been the same.

As far as the Iraq vote goes: while i disagreed with Hillary and would not of voted the same way, her vote was not because of a lack of scruples or temperment. Their was some core principles involved in it. That is that the congress should stand behind the president as far as use of force goes especially when it comes to coercive diplomacy. Bill Clinton expected the support of Congress for Kosovo and, by and large, he got it. Bush stated repeatedly that the use of force resolution was not a vote for War at the time.

Maybe Hillary was wrong to believe him, however i don't think it's fair to blame the person who was lied to as much as the liar.

Here's what Joseph Wilson, no fan of the Iraq war or George Bush (but he IS a fan of Hillary Clinton's) had to say about the Iraq war vote:

""Well, I think the fact that's dominated the narrative is an indication of how little people really understand the dynamics of the debate as it was going on at the time. And the people making a lot of hay over this weren't there. I was there. I was fighting the fight. I looked to the left of me. I looked to the right of me. I didn't see Barack Obama anywhere. I was out there and there is nobody who can deny that. ... I didn't talk to Edwards about it because he was a co-sponsor of that particular resolution, whereas a lot of us were trying to fight for more restrictive language. Being in the minority, you couldn't get that restrictive language at that time. So what happened the day after the bill was passed? Hillary Clinton and Robert Byrd went down and submitted another bill which further restricted, attempted to restrict the ability for the president to act. But in actual fact, those who were there are the debate will remember that the American people and the U.S. Congress were sold on this resolution not because the president wanted to go to war, because he said publicly, I do not want this resolution to go to war. I want this resolution so I can get to the United Nations and get intrusive inspections. That's what Colin Powell said. That's what the president of the United States said and that's what they got. They got a resolution that permitted the president of the United States to go to the U.N. and get intrusive inspections. The great betrayal of the America people is not in that Resolution. It was in the president not allowing the inspections to reach their natural conclusions. Her short circuited the process. That is the betrayal of the country. That is the betrayal of the Congress. That's the betrayal of the American people. That's the betrayal of the world. People who don't remember that are trying to spin this for their own particular short-term partisan interest and they should not be allowed to get away with it. The most important thing of course now, that aside, ... is what is it going to take to get out of there in a way that, one, protects our national security interests, which has been terribly compromised in the region. ... ..""

If you want to call Joe Wilson a liar, you'll be in the same company as George Bush.

Originally Posted by Insipid

Her campaign has been in now way abomminable.

Originally Posted by Insipid

Obama would certainly think it irrational to not vote for Hillary should she get the nomination. He has said so on many occaisions.

Originally Posted by Insipid

Maybe Hillary was wrong to believe him, however i don't think it's fair to blame the person who was lied to as much as the liar.

Originally Posted by Insipid

If you want to call Joe Wilson a liar, you'll be in the same company as George Bush.

Originally Posted by winthrop

My theory, of course, suggests she was more inept than evil, and the Hate Hillary group accepts
nothing but evil as an explanation. Ineptness under fire, however, should really be enough.

Originally Posted by DRS112

I disagree...I've always thought she was crap(evil is too strong) and even called it a couple years ago that there was no way she would make it to the whitehouse.

Originally Posted by winthrop

You disagree ineptness is not enough?

Originally Posted by itsmeeeeeee

May 15, 2008
Categories: Hillary Clinton

Ben Smith's Blog: Clinton backer backlash - Politico.com

Clinton backer backlash

My colleague Beth Frerking reports on something we're likely to hear a lot more about in coming days: Grumblings from the almost-half of the party, disproportionately women, whose candidate is losing.

An Ohio-based group of Democratic Hillary Clinton supporters say they’ll work actively against Sen. Barack Obama if he becomes the nominee, arguing that Clinton has been the subject of “intense sexism” by party leaders and the media.

Led by Boomer-aged women, the group, Clinton Supporters Count Too, is holding a press conference in Columbus at noon to release this statement.

Organizers Cynthia Ruccia, 55, and Jamie Dixey, 57, both from the Columbus area, say they’re coordinating women, men, minorities, union members and others in Ohio, Pennsylvania, Florida and Michigan – all important swing states next November – to impress upon Democratic party leaders what they think has been outright discrimination – and not of the racial kind.

“We have been vigilant against expressions of racism, and we are thrilled that the society has advanced that way” in accepting Obama as a serious candidate,” Ruccia said. “But it’s been open season on women, and we feel we need to stand up and make a statement about that, because it’s wrong.”

With growing calls for Clinton to leave the race, she said, women feel like “we’re being told to sit down, shut up, and get with the program.”

Hard to know what to make of any given group, but the sentiment is clearly out there, and putting the party back together will be Obama's, and Clinton's, challenge.

Oh, and they're doing O'Reilly tonight, of course.


-----------------------------------------------------


INTENSE SEXISM?

REALLY?


can ANYONE post ONE example of obama's intense sexism?
OR ANY EXAMPLE OF SEXISM AT ALL?

this is complete horseshit!
these are the kind of women who give women a bad name!

Originally Posted by winthrop

Thank you for that. I would like for Obama-only supporters to step forward
and make their stand either way, but I expect perhaps only one to respond.
I will not pre-judge any answer, if they are forecoming.

I am not sure, the booing we heard yesterday to the contrary, that all
Obama-only supporters are as hostile as some on this board. It is its own
microcosm, but not necessarily a representative of the real world.

Originally Posted by Mithrall

First off I want to correct you on something I found very disturbing. It is not the duty of Congress to stand behind the President, it is thier duty to act as a check and balance to the Executive(President) and Judicial Branches(Courts). Our government is set up in the way that it is for exactly this purpose. Bad things tend to happen when they fail in that duty. Secondly you are errantly equating both of them voting the same way to having the same decision making process. If you don't understand the difference I don't see any point in furthering this discussion.

Originally Posted by Mithrall

That is a matter of opinion and I am entitled to mine and you are entitled to yours.