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Old 06-04-2008, 07:55 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Do Progressive Democrats live in their own bubble?

Obama’s superb campaign is a proud moment for the country. It could be the beginning of an American redemption in the eyes of the world. What made me think that Obama really could win this election was hearing my Republican wife call Obama "inspirational", and seeing the thousands of people at his speaking events. I found this post on another site and thought it stated my fears so clearly and realistically.

Quote:
We Democrats and Independents like nothing more than to talk about Bush’s "bubble" — the fantasy land full of 'yes' men he has surrounded himself with, where he is the Good Flight-Suit-In-Chief leading us into a foolish war of choice.

But I worry we have built our own bubble, and that that bubble can best be described as a The Earnest Belief That America Is Ready To Elect A President Who Isn’t A White Dude.

I’ve gotten to the point that I believe Senator Obama, at the very least, has a very real chance to win the Presidency. I try not to think that I’ve drunk any Kool-Aid.

And yet, there’s this still small voice deep inside me that says “ARE YOU CRAZY??? THIS IS AMERICA!!!”

The America that distributed smallpox infected blankets to the people who were living here originally, and that put the survivors of those people on the worst land it could find.

The America that annexed Hawaii by force and near-genocide so a rich guy named Dole could get a little richer selling inexpensive pineapple in cans.

The America that killed a few thousand people in the Phillippine Islands so another rich guy named Hearst could sell some newspapers.

The American that rounded up Americans of Japanese descent and put them in concentration camps because, unlike all the Americans of German and Italian descent, the Japanese Americans weren’t white.

The America that, by and large, shrugs and goes about its business while soldiers wearing its flag on their uniform kill, maim, and torture thousands of Iraqis and Afghanis.

The America that elected and re-elected a posturing fraudulent foolish failure to its highest office… or didn’t, but stood by and watched while he and his handlers stole both elections right in front of our eyes, anyway.

The America that ties gay kids to trees and throws rocks at their heads until they die.

Yeah, yeah, we look at the polls and we fill out our surveys and we rejoice at the news that Obama is leading McCain nationally.

Prices will go down, wages will go up, our factories will reopen and everyone will get good jobs making $30 an hour and our bridges and highways and cities and suburbs will flourish and grow and American will once more take its rightful place as internationally beloved and universally respected leader of the Free World and President Obama will personally invent a time machine and change history so that Taylor Hicks never won AMERICAN IDOL.

All will be well, and all will be well, and ALL will be well, world without end, amen.

And… are we kidding ourselves? Are we? Do we really think… do we really dare to HOPE… that America, the America of gas guzzling SUVs and cheap Wal-mart prices supported by Chinese slave labor and crappy health care and thousands dead and missing after Katrina and CIA offshore black sites and Abu Ghraib and free speech zones and the PATRIOT Act… that our America, the one we all live in, is going to elect a black man… ANY black man, much less one whose middle name is Hussein and whose last name rhymes with Osama… to be its President?

Do we really believe this?

And if we do… are we living in a bubble, too? A Democratic-liberal-progressive bubble, where we only see what we want to see, and we only believe what we fervently truly really really really want to be true?

I hope not. I hope we’re ready. I hope we’ve come far enough.
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Old 06-04-2008, 09:37 AM   #2 (permalink)
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The real hope is in the fact that we do not yet know...as opposed to
knowing without the slightest doubt that this country will not elect a
Black man, which certainly would have been the case not at all long
ago.

Mr. Obama certainly has the rhetorical talents to make Mr. McCain
look like the ineffectual, out of date and pandering flip-flopper he
very clearly is, and if the voters of this country really want to change
the course of the past eight years, if they have learned that having
a beer with someone is a fine criteria for a weekend barbeque host
but insufficient at best for a president, if they have learned that
"conservative" economic policies of giving corporations whatever they
want even if it all but destroys the workers who make their profits
possible, if they have learned that our brand of self governing, which at
least attempts to be fair and equitable to disparate points of view,
cannot be exported behind a gun or after a bomb, then Mr. McCain
will be rejected by a landslide far too large for the more shadowy
forces of Republican operatives to steal yet again.

Mr. Obama has the talent to be elected in spite of the long, ugly
history of race relations in this country. I believe this time even the
remnants of that history may be overwhelmed, and we can see
history made, this time in a good way.

But we will not know for sure until the day it happens. Until then we
can only work and, yes, hope.
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Old 06-04-2008, 09:55 AM   #3 (permalink)
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He's very capable. But we can't put it all on him, to take this historic step.

We will have to work extremely hard this time, to defeat those who fear this kind of progress. We will have to make the extra effort to break this barrier, which while eroded, still exists.


It will make it easier that Obama is such a worth while standard bearer.
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Old 06-04-2008, 10:09 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Quote:
Democratic-liberal-progressive bubble
here's my problem with this.
True " progressives" don't identify themselves as liberal-
but the words has been bastardized to just mean liberal.

Progressive thinking is outside the box of liberal/conservative

It's the idea of looking for a solution, or a best policy, regardless of idealogy. - at least that's my take on it.
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Old 06-04-2008, 10:23 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CosmicRocker View Post
here's my problem with this.
True " progressives" don't identify themselves as liberal-
but the words has been bastardized to just mean liberal.

Progressive thinking is outside the box of liberal/conservative

It's the idea of looking for a solution, or a best policy, regardless of idealogy. - at least that's my take on it.
I think that is what makes Mr. Obama a source of that hope
that is proffered so often. While Mr. Bush's "uniter not divider" claim
was more self promotional smoke and mirrors, it seems Mr. Obama
himself, if not some of his supporters, is willing, indeed anxious, to
reach across divides and find mutual solutions. The problem of course
is with the Republicans and whether they are willing to put aside their
previously successful methods of fear and attack; assuming there are
enough of them left in the congress after January to matter.
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Old 06-04-2008, 11:00 AM   #6 (permalink)
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I don't really understand this slam against progressive dems.

-Progressive dems were against the Iraq war and were most skeptical of the slogans "war will pay for itself", "greeted as liberators", "Mission accomplished", etc.
How did that work out for the country?

-Progressive Dems were against the appointments of Sec of state Rice, AG Alberto Gonzales, Justice Roberts and Alito.
How that work out for the rest of the country?
(Continued failed war policy, pro immenent domain, pro-corp legislation, etc. etc.)

Progressive dems support National Election integrity.
How did that work out in '04?

Before slamming a political group why not find more about their policies and the people behind it.
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Old 06-04-2008, 11:18 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by winthrop View Post
I think that is what makes Mr. Obama a source of that hope
that is proffered so often. While Mr. Bush's "uniter not divider" claim
was more self promotional smoke and mirrors, it seems Mr. Obama
himself, if not some of his supporters, is willing, indeed anxious, to
reach across divides and find mutual solutions. The problem of course
is with the Republicans and whether they are willing to put aside their
previously successful methods of fear and attack; assuming there are
enough of them left in the congress after January to matter.
that sounds good, but we'll have to see if there is any meat on them bones, or if it's just a sales job.
willing to meet is fine, but hard compromises are what gets it done.Time will tell
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Old 06-04-2008, 11:20 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by julia View Post
I don't really understand this slam against progressive dems.

-Progressive dems were against the Iraq war and were most skeptical of the slogans "war will pay for itself", "greeted as liberators", "Mission accomplished", etc.
How did that work out for the country?

-Progressive Dems were against the appointments of Sec of state Rice, AG Alberto Gonzales, Justice Roberts and Alito.
How that work out for the rest of the country?
(Continued failed war policy, pro immenent domain, pro-corp legislation, etc. etc.)

Progressive dems support National Election integrity.
How did that work out in '04?

Before slamming a political group why not find more about their policies and the people behind it.
it's not a slam. it's more how you define " progressive"
does it just mean very liberal?
or does it mean searching outside the box, for practicle, progressive ideas to get things done?
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Old 06-04-2008, 11:25 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Progressive is just code for liberal. The left has a monopoly on it.
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Old 06-04-2008, 11:37 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by julia View Post
I don't really understand this slam against progressive dems.

-Progressive dems were against the Iraq war and were most skeptical of the slogans "war will pay for itself", "greeted as liberators", "Mission accomplished", etc.
How did that work out for the country?

-Progressive Dems were against the appointments of Sec of state Rice, AG Alberto Gonzales, Justice Roberts and Alito.
How that work out for the rest of the country?
(Continued failed war policy, pro immenent domain, pro-corp legislation, etc. etc.)

Progressive dems support National Election integrity.
How did that work out in '04?

Before slamming a political group why not find more about their policies and the people behind it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CosmicRocker View Post
it's not a slam. it's more how you define " progressive"
does it just mean very liberal?
or does it mean searching outside the box, for practicle, progressive ideas to get things done?
The thread title speaks for itself:
Do Progressive Democrats live in their own bubble?

I just posted some progressive Dem positions for which we were slammed for years.

But guess what? Americans have finally reached a tipping point and are are the sick of all the political posturing that has been going on that last plus seven years.

People are also sick of political labels because the many great problems facing our country will take Americans to solve, not political labels.

Pssst! That's a known right wing tactic to use excessive political labels and claim that this country is soooo divided.
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