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Old 12-26-2007, 10:13 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by lollipop View Post
Nice posts guys. I haven't been to the zoo since I was a kid (probably a school trip) and I have no plans of going back any time soon and this story (and many like it) are the reason why. I don't find them necessary or educational. I think it's exploiting animals and inhumane to deprive them of their freedom and natural instincts.

I really wish they hadn't killed this tiger. Why couldn't have just tranquilize the tiger and put her back in her cage? Why was she killed for doing something that comes naturally to her? Isn't that contradictory and hypocritical of a zoo?
Well sadly, at that point it becomes a public safety issue. The cat had already killed(not the cat's fault,that's what's hardwired into them) the cops knew it had killed once already, saw it standing next to, and attacking someone else.........no choice at that point but to use lethal force. A tranq wouldn't work fast enough, and a Tiger that's killed before will easily do it again befor the tranq could take effect. Sadly, they had to do it and it was their duty to stop the tiger. It seems now as if there was some possible instigation/antagonizing of the animal prior to this event. Too bad. But can you imagine the outrage if that tiger had killed her 3rd victims with the police just standing by, horrified, with loaded Glock pistols in their hands? They had to shoot, and thankfully their bullets flew true with no collateral damage.
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Old 12-26-2007, 10:57 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Dr. Zaius View Post
I have always been more of a supporter for places like Walt Disney worlds Animal safari that looks like a natural habitat. I would however like to see even more space for those animals and take the emphasis off keeping them in full view of an audience. It means that although it looks like a natural habitat, they still have very limited space. We need to emphasize the comfort of the animal and not displaying it everyday..
Animal Kingdom at Disney is pretty well maintained. The cats at least can roam their "territory".

The whole zoo thing is awful. sadly we are destroying habitat so fast, that may be the last hold out for wild animals
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Old 12-26-2007, 11:06 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by gorillamom View Post
I just heard a reporter say "The Tiger escaped from it's pen!" Well did it occur to antone that it should never have been in a pen in the first place?
This is definitely a case of pushing a tiger way too far.
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Old 12-26-2007, 11:12 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by SPRINGFIELD View Post
Tell us, if you ever have the time. Because I have always suspected that they are way too smart and human-like to be zoo exhibits or science test mules. I'd like to know some of your thoughts and observations on gorillas. Because like I said in my previous post, looking into his eyes was not your typical human/animal experience. He was self aware, a sentient being that did not want to be where he was. And I'd be interested to hear an expert's opinion on wether or not that perception of mine was true or not.
Well every aspect of their lives are controlled by humans for one. What and when they eat, how much, never enough, when they out and come in, and the worst part is they have no choice in who they live and mate with. That is decided by the SSP (Species Survival plan). Some zoos are better than others, but for the most part they have no choises in their lives. What pissed me off was when they threw a fit if one of the gorillas gained 1 pound! We weighed them once a week, or more. We had a male (Kiki) and a female (Binti) and the zoo wanted her to breed with our other male Pete. She didn't want to because she loved Kiki. Gorillas never share their food and Kiki would bring Binti his food! Then the SSP decided to move her to New Orleans because she refused to mate with Pete. 21 days after she was moved Kiki died of a sudden heart attack. Perfectly healthy 25 year old male. Binti didn't mate with the male in New Orleans for many years. The day she was moved all the gorillas were let outside and when they door was closed not letting Binti out they started screaming and did all day until the next day. It was horrible.
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Old 12-26-2007, 11:13 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by CosmicRocker View Post
Animal Kingdom at Disney is pretty well maintained. The cats at least can roam their "territory".

The whole zoo thing is awful. sadly we are destroying habitat so fast, that may be the last hold out for wild animals
Then it may be best to let them go extinct. Captivity is no life.
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Old 12-26-2007, 11:26 PM   #16 (permalink)
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This is definitely a case of pushing a tiger way too far.
Yes. I have no doubt they were harrassing the tiger. Most born in captivity animals don't want to get out and when they do, they panic. I know. I used to go in the cage with the Oranutangs, but when they all got loose, they wanted me to get them back in their cages! They always called me when an animal got out. But when it came to the big cats, oh hell no. Primates, no problem. But lion and tigers and bears; OH MY!
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Old 12-26-2007, 11:37 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by gorillamom View Post
Yes. I have no doubt they were harrassing the tiger. Most born in captivity animals don't want to get out and when they do, they panic. I know. I used to go in the cage with the Oranutangs, but when they all got loose, they wanted me to get them back in their cages! They always called me when an animal got out. But when it came to the big cats, oh hell no. Primates, no problem. But lion and tigers and bears; OH MY!
The thing about tigers especially, and other predators in general is they don't put up with bullshit as much as other animals. On one of the documentary channels they showed the raising of tigers with people, but the tigers looked so different from wild tigers it struck me as the first step to attempted domestication [intentionally or otherwise]. So while there's a remote chance of domestic tigers [a contradiction in terms to me, but that's an opinion] the wild tigers are probably screwed, given what we read of the Chinese zoo.
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Old 12-26-2007, 11:39 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by The_Heretic View Post
The thing about tigers especially, and other predators in general is they don't put up with bullshit as much as other animals. On one of the documentary channels they showed the raising of tigers with people, but the tigers looked so different from wild tigers it struck me as the first step to attempted domestication [intentionally or otherwise]. So while there's a remote chance of domestic tigers [a contradiction in terms to me, but that's an opinion] the wild tigers are probably screwed, given what we read of the Chinese zoo.
They are screwed. Either way it's not good. Man we humans fucked up real bad.
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Old 12-26-2007, 11:47 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by gorillamom View Post
They are screwed. Either way it's not good. Man we humans fucked up real bad.
If you see the show the zoo born tigers have widly different colors from a wild tiger, and- while still tigers, many of their more dangerous behaviors are reduced to the point that zoo visitors are allowed to touch the tigers and they stroll the place with their handlers.

Yeah, that's an "incident" waiting to happen.
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Old 12-26-2007, 11:56 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by The_Heretic View Post
If you see the show the zoo born tigers have widly different colors from a wild tiger, and- while still tigers, many of their more dangerous behaviors are reduced to the point that zoo visitors are allowed to touch the tigers and they stroll the place with their handlers.

Yeah, that's an "incident" waiting to happen.
Yes, we did that for a while at Woodland Park with some of the animals. Then stopped because the insurance wasn't happy with that. For once I was in agreement with an insurance company! These animals are at risk of catching human diseases, especially primates. We had to use a step pan of disinfectant before entering the unit, and wash our hands before getting close to them. We didn't wear masks though or use surgical gloves. We just had to make sure if we got a hint of a runny nose we called in for someone to fill in. I also emailed MSNBC about what I know about zoos and asked them to do a story. Like that will happen. What made me mad about Ivan the gorilla i took care of was the news stations have an agreement with the zoos and never once reported on all the mistakes made with Ivan after his move and promoted it as a success when it was a total failure. It was hard to listen to people at the zoo go on and on about what a failure he was. He was in hearing distance and understands English. They destroyed his self confidence.
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