Why vote for Obama? - Page 8

Rollerball · 05-14-2008, 10:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bornright

The video was of Obama stating that he had been to 57 of the states so far and was to soon go to another one. Apparently the State of confusion was one of the states he had visited.

yeah right

and I had a video of McCain saying he would make the Wizard of Oz his VP and the Munchkins would all be drafted to invade Iran.

...but that video isn't available anymore either. darn.

VKMHVM2 · 05-14-2008, 11:35 PM

YouTube - Obama Claims He's Visited 57 States

cheapseats · 05-15-2008, 12:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VKMHVM2

YouTube - Obama Claims He's Visited 57 States

The text on this video, also less than compelling:

Quote:

Because, you know, it is just wonderful to be back in Oregon and over the last fifteen months, we've traveled to every corner of the United States. I've now been in fifteee s-seven states? I think one left to go. One left to go...Alaska and Hawaii, I was not allowed to go to even though I really wanted to visit but my staff would not justify it.

RK77 · 05-15-2008, 01:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rollerball

OH MY GOD!!!! SOMEONE BETTER TAKE THAT SUPER DELEGATE STATUS AWAY FROM THOSE CHILDREN QUICK!!! THEIR BRAINS ARE STILL DEVELOPING FOR GODSAKE!!!

THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!!!!

So lemme get this straight. Because YouTube and Facebook are so vast and well used, that means the views of 5,000 or so equates to diddly-squat. Is that what you're getting at here?

This is fun.

Yeah---and the brains of a hell of a lot of people stopped developing altogether before they reached 15. So? which is worse?

cheapseats · 05-15-2008, 03:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richterscale

And while we're on the subject of accurate information, this statement... "It does trouble me a little that he knows more about these groups than he does this country.", is bizarre and improbable.

Barack Obama Biography - Biography.com

Quote:

Following the 9/11 attacks, Obama was an early opponent of President George W. Bush's push to war with Iraq. Obama was still a state senator when he spoke against a resolution authorizing the use of force against Iraq during a rally at Chicago's Federal Plaza in October 2002.

"I am not opposed to all wars. I’m opposed to dumb wars," he said. "What I am opposed to is the cynical attempt by Richard Perle and Paul Wolfowitz and other arm-chair, weekend warriors in this Administration to shove their own ideological agendas down our throats, irrespective of the costs in lives lost and in hardships borne."

"He’s a bad guy," Obama said, referring to Iraqi dictator Saddam Hussein. "The world, and the Iraqi people, would be better off without him. But I also know that Saddam poses no imminent and direct threat to the United States, or to his neighbors, that the Iraqi economy is in shambles, that the Iraqi military a fraction of its former strength, and that in concert with the international community he can be contained until, in the way of all petty dictators, he falls away into the dustbin of history."

"I know that even a successful war against Iraq will require a U.S. occupation of undetermined length, at undetermined cost, with undetermined consequences," Obama continued. "I know that an invasion of Iraq without a clear rationale and without strong international support will only fan the flames of the Middle East, and encourage the worst, rather than best, impulses of the Arab world, and strengthen the recruitment arm of al-Qaeda."

In 2002, was this common knowledge amongst opponents of the war?

Me, I never had any way of knowing whether Saddam Hussein posed an imminent threat or not. I thought that's how we got incited into applauding television screens as brave troops, awesome artillery and embedded journalists thundered into Baghdad.

Richterscale · 05-15-2008, 05:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cheapseats

Barack

Obama Biography - Biography.com

Quote:

In 2002, was this common knowledge amongst opponents of the war?

Me, I never had any way of knowing whether Saddam Hussein posed an imminent threat or not. I thought that's how we got incited into applauding television screens as brave troops, awesome artillery and embedded journalists thundered into Baghdad.

Well, this person seemed to know what was going on in Feb 2003.

Quote:

Letter: Iraq is no threat
Issue date: 2/6/03 Section: Commentary

I continue to be shocked and dismayed at the unjustified support of war against Iraq, which I once again saw in Sean Nottage's column "War with Iraq is inevitable and much needed." Like so many who are calling for war, his arguments rely on lies that the Bush administration have repeated so often that people have taken them as fact.

First off, the tragedy with the Columbia space shuttle was terrible, and I am sickened by anyone who celebrates innocent deaths. However, Nottage's idea that the reaction of a few Iraqis is justification for war is beyond absurd. It is an insult to the victims and degrades the very serious issue of whether or not we should go to war.

I continue reading about how Iraq's lack of cooperation gives us the right to invade. It is obvious that Iraq has not been perfect in its disclosure of possible weapons. But there is also no proof that they have weapons either. Bush claims that Iraq can have nuclear weapons within a year, but weapons inspectors are discovering first hand that Iraq has no capability to make nuclear weapons. By the time inspectors left in 1998, nearly all of Iraq's weapons had been destroyed. Even more importantly, Iraq's weapons factories were completely destroyed. Any chemicals that may have remained in Iraq would have expired years ago. Inspectors should remain in Iraq to keep such weapons out of Saddam Hussein's hands, but the case for war has not yet been made.

Even if Iraq were to possess some weapons, there is no evidence that they plan to use them. Say what you will about Saddam Hussein, but he realizes that attacking America would ensure his death. They have never been a threat to attack America. Nottage also talked about the threat of Hussein selling weapons to terrorist groups like al-Qaeda. That sounds like a threat, until one realized that Hussein is a secular leader, and that he has always been an enemy of such Islamic fundamentalists. Osama bin Laden has even called for Hussein's death in the past. If people took the time to learn these facts, Bush could not get away with instilling fear in the American people without any factual evidence. Another important issue that no one wants to talk about is what will happen if Hussein is removed from power. Democracy will not occur overnight, and the question of who is in power after Hussein is a critical one. Sixty percent of Iraqis are Shi's Muslims. This group is in power in Iran, a country Bush dubbed as part of his "axis of evil." Twenty-three percent are Kurds, who have been fought by Turkey when trying to establish an independent Kurdistan. Putting such a group in power could potentially add more instability to the region. The remaining seventeen percent are Sunnis, like Hussein. If someone from Hussein's party were in power, is there any guarantee the country would be better off? I do not, by any means, think Hussein is the best option to run Iraq. However, it is clear that achieving peace and democracy may be just as difficult even after he is removed. As a country, we should be concerned with threats to our safety and well-being. The fact is that Iraq is not a threat to us at this time. I urge people to closely examine what is fact and what is fiction. Do not simply base your decisions on what Bush tells you. It is his administration's premature cries for war that are the greatest threat to our peace. Blindly following his word will lead to tragic and unnecessary deaths for Americans and Iraqis.

-Kelly McCabe

Many of us who opposed the Iraq invasion (I did not oppose Afghanistan) found this stuff out after a few hours on the internets. None of this stuff was a secret, you just had to be curious enough (and distrusting of the MSM enough to go find it.

anhailla · 05-15-2008, 06:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richterscale

Well, this person seemed to know what was going on in Feb 2003.

Many of us who opposed the Iraq invasion (I did not oppose Afghanistan) found this stuff out after a few hours on the internets. None of this stuff was a secret, you just had to be curious enough (and distrusting of the MSM enough to go find it.

I distinctly remember when the Des Moines Register ran some ridiculous story about how the Iraqi's were hauling the WDM's around the country on trains, so that the UN couldn't find them.

I turned to a Surgeon I worked for at the time (we were both reading the paper) and said...."this is horseshit....starting a war over there would be a disaster."

He argued, and I remember thinking...that normally smart people had lost their minds, and we were in big trouble, I was sincerely frightened

anywho, we continued to argue all day. I was so frustrated I refused to work with him...lol!!!!

we later made up.

Just an example of how powerful propaganda (combined with fear) is...He is now very against the war.

Titanium Cat · 05-15-2008, 07:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cheapseats

The text on this video, also less than compelling:

A long campaign and he got confused and said fifty instead of forty. Probably thinking 50 and then subtracting off the states he hadn't been to and then forgetting to correct down to 40 before saying the seven.

Big whoop.

Rollerball · 05-15-2008, 07:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by anhailla

I distinctly remember when the Des Moines Register ran some ridiculous story about how the Iraqi's were hauling the WDM's around the country on trains, so that the UN couldn't find them.

I turned to a Surgeon I worked for at the time (we were both reading the paper) and said...."this is horseshit....starting a war over there would be a disaster."

He argued, and I remember thinking...that normally smart people had lost their minds, and we were in big trouble, I was sincerely frightened

anywho, we continued to argue all day. I was so frustrated I refused to work with him...lol!!!!

we later made up.

Just an example of how powerful propaganda (combined with fear) is...He is now very against the war.

Remember all the drawings they had of mobil poison gas labs.

And this bit of fantasy about an advanced Osama's hideout Tora Bora

I remember Cheney and Rummy standing next the enlarged satellite photos of the actual WMDs on the ground.

And we ate it up without question.

Heretic · 05-15-2008, 07:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rollerball

Remember all the drawings they had of mobil poison gas labs.

And this bit of fantasy about an advanced Osama's hideout Tora Bora

I remember Cheney and Rummy standing next the enlarged satellite photos of the actual WMDs on the ground.

And we ate it up without question.

I get a kick out of the minivan in the lower left corner. A car like that is useless in Tora Bora.

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