Quirkygal

"I'd like to see a hybrid of teachers and computers in say 4th through 12th grades. In many classes there can be a combination of maybe one weekly classroom study and interaction with other studies of the same subject done on the computer anytime during that week. There are surely lots of ideas how to marry computers with teaching but like most things it will probably take decades to implement this."
~~~~~

It's a matter of using computers effectively in the classroom. Many teachers are terrific at this, while others are simply not up to speed.

PowerPoint is fantastic for making lessons. Still, if every lesson were done in PowerPoint it wouldn't be the same. Poetry should still be read aloud. Science should still be taught by inquiry (experiments). Oh, and don't forget the good old-fashioned "do the algebra problem on the board in front of the class" tactic. (That'll teach you to do your homework pretty damn fast!)

You get the idea.

There are older teachers who, despite ongoing training, simply don't utilize the technology that is available.

In poor districts there are often not enough computers for the students to use. The ones they do have are generally poor quality and outdated.

Personally, I don't think the $100 laptop is a cure-all. Technology can be wonderful, but it's only as good as the instruction that goes along with it.

Also worth noting: Not all kids enjoy working on the computer for extended periods of time. It can be tedious for adults. Kids are smart; they know it's more fun to play games on the computer. As soon as the teacher wants them to read extensively (15 minutes..ha) or WRITE about a topic they start complaining! Kids are still KIDS.

OldManOnFire

A quick story; The state guru of education of a mid-Atlantic state one day found out that cursive writing and reading was no longer being taught in public schools. So this state administrator barked the command that all schools will immediately add this back into their curriculum. A week later someone representing the teachers responded by saying; Okay this can be done but not for the next two years--first we must educate our teachers who themselves do not understand cursive...end of story.

Software is not an issue...it can be created to do anything.

All of them should be fired! And all of the administrators who are too stupid to provide an efficient teacher pool should be fired! This is one major problem with education; no one is ever fired for poor or inadequate performance.

All the administrators who do not create an equitable situation in all public schools should immediately be fired!!

Of course it's not panacea...this is why I commented about a 'hybrid' situation.

Attention spans are fully understood...and using computers must be designed with this fact in mind, just as they must be in classroom teaching.

__________________
Did you know both our problems and the solutions can be found simply by looking in our mirrors...and...Never confuse the extraordinary stuff I think and write with that of a well-balanced person...

Quirkygal

[quote=OldManOnFire;193842]A quick story; The state guru of education of a mid-Atlantic state one day found out that cursive writing and reading was no longer being taught in public schools. So this state administrator barked the command that all schools will immediately add this back into their curriculum. A week later someone representing the teachers responded by saying; Okay this can be done but not for the next two years--first we must educate our teachers who themselves do not understand cursive...end of story.

That's ridiculous. What state?

You might find this interesting. (I teach in CA, btw.)

School Proficiencies Inconsistent: Standards Vary From State to State

Quirkygal

Quote:
PowerPoint is fantastic for making lessons. Still, if every lesson were done in PowerPoint it wouldn't be the same. Poetry should still be read aloud. Science should still be taught by inquiry (experiments). Oh, and don't forget the good old-fashioned "do the algebra problem on the board in front of the class" tactic. (That'll teach you to do your homework pretty damn fast!)

Software is not an issue...it can be created to do anything.
~~~~~~~

We'll agree to disagree on this!


Quote:
There are older teachers who, despite ongoing training, simply don't utilize the technology that is available.

All of them should be fired! And all of the administrators who are too stupid to provide an efficient teacher pool should be fired! This is one major problem with education; no one is ever fired for poor or inadequate performance.
~~~~~~~~

In CA there are significant teacher shortages. There are also many teachers who are nearing retirement. Those baby boomers are pretty tough to fire after 25 years of teaching....



Quote:
In poor districts there are often not enough computers for the students to use. The ones they do have are generally poor quality and outdated.

All the administrators who do not create an equitable situation in all public schools should immediately be fired!!
~~~~~~~

You're not alone here!


Quote:
Personally, I don't think the $100 laptop is a cure-all. Technology can be wonderful, but it's only as good as the instruction that goes along with it.

Of course it's not panacea...this is why I commented about a 'hybrid' situation.
~~~~~~~

It varies a lot from grade level to grade level. K-3 requires MUCH more small group or 1:1 instruction to ensure that basic concepts are understood. This is even more important in the states (CA, AZ, TX, etc.) where large numbers of students are learning English:

SDAIE

SDAIE classes are those classes containing LEP students, taught by teachers using special techniques and strategies designed to assist LEP students in both language-acquisition and subject-matter content. SDAIE stands for Specially-Designed Academic-Instruction in English.

To understand the purpose of SDAIE (often referred to as "sheltered instruction"), the umbrella is a useful metaphor. After LEP students enter United States schools, they encounter many unfamiliar elements. As an umbrella shelters pedestrians in a rain-storm, so SDAIE/sheltered classes offer LEP students some protection from the storm of concepts, contexts, and language, thus giving them the opportunity to progress academically as they acquire English language proficiency.

SDAIE/sheltered methodology, borrowed from ELD/ESL strategies, emphasizes the concept of comprehensible input - very simply, making concepts understood by the learner. This is accomplished through the use of:

realia (real objects and materials)
manipulatives (drawings, posters, brainstorming-clusters, graphs, tables, maps, props, multimedia presentations, storyboards, storymaps)
visuals (study-prints, text book-illustrations, overhead-projected prints, reproductions of paintings, and documents)
graphic organizers (matrices, Venn diagrams, and webs)
planned opportunities for interaction between all individuals in the classroom (creating a skit and acting it out, co-operative learning, collaborative learning, and student-generated stories based on personal experiences)

TASSI: SDAIE Handbook -- Techniques, Strategies, and Suggestions for Teachers of LEP and Former LEP Students


Quote:
Also worth noting: Not all kids enjoy working on the computer for extended periods of time. It can be tedious for adults. Kids are smart; they know it's more fun to play games on the computer. As soon as the teacher wants them to read extensively (15 minutes..ha) or WRITE about a topic they start complaining! Kids are still KIDS.

Attention spans are fully understood...and using computers must be designed with this fact in mind, just as they must be in classroom teaching.
~~~~~~~~

There is a place for technology in each grade level, but it will look very different. For example, one important part of instruction for K-5 is keyboarding. By the 4th or 5th grade students can begin to use the computer to write small reports and summaries. There are also plenty of good programs that review basic math, reading and spelling skills.

OldManOnFire

I believe it was in North Carolina.

Thank you for the article. South Carolina has a high school graduation rate of 62% so I'm surprised to see them on the list of the highest proficiencies??

I'm also in CA in the North Bay area but I'm not a teacher...a farmer.

__________________
Did you know both our problems and the solutions can be found simply by looking in our mirrors...and...Never confuse the extraordinary stuff I think and write with that of a well-balanced person...

OldManOnFire

And this in a nutshell has been the downfall of public education! No one can be fired no matter their performance as long as they have tenure. So all the teachers and administrators protect their own asses at the expense of having the best education system...how self-serving this has been. Compensation is based on tenure and further education credits and not on performance! Please correct me if I am wrong??

So in a system where we should have the best and the brightest, the program is designed to do the opposite. Sure there are good and great teachers but this discussion is never about them. It's about a failing education system!

And regarding that so-called teacher shortage which is not a new problem, what has the education system done to change this?? Have they provided a safe, secure and optimum facility for education...hell no...run down schools, little to no supplies, obsolete equipment, crime, drugs, shootings, etc. Have they provided appropriate policy and discipline at the student levels to assure classroom civility...I don't think so. Have they created a situation in which quality teachers are highly compensated and treated as important mentors...I don't think so.

And, has the public education system ever once figured out what it's actual mission might be...I don't think so! Are they baby-sitters? Are they problem-solvers for families? Are they creating an education system with criteria or just a facade? Since the high school graduation rate is 72%, is this their mission?

How can grades 5-12 be filled with failures, and crime, and drugs, and guns, and in many cases be considered out of control...yet all of this changes when they enter college????? In college you either succeed or you fail...in public education everyone is frightened to fail a kid?

I know it's a thankless job on many days and I know there are some wonderful educators and I know I speak harshly...but harshness is what is necessary to fix a major problem. Decade after decade public education is discussed, the problems become worse, and we are failing millions of kids and what serious change have we seen to combat this?

The public education system is broken...it's a drop-out factory...and the world is passing the USA by in education...and all we can do is make more excuses...

__________________
Did you know both our problems and the solutions can be found simply by looking in our mirrors...and...Never confuse the extraordinary stuff I think and write with that of a well-balanced person...

Quirkygal

~~~~~~
Someone at the beginning of this thread pointed to (1) parental involvement and (2) level of parental education/income.

There's a lot of truth to that, actually. The system is a helluva lot easier for the kids with educated parents and a few dollars to spend on high-speed internet. That's not to say it's not possible to get out of a bad neighborhood or go to college when your parents did not...

it's just not particularly likely or easy.

Quirkygal

I really need to learn how to do that cool "multi-quote" thing!

OldManOnFire

I'll kindly disagree with this to the extent it's not required. I always comment that there's only three things parents must provide to their kids regarding education; Food in their stomachs, a good nights rest, and a dedicated place to study.

Of course certain types of parental involvement can be great while others might be very negative. And no matter if one is a parent or not, the more educated they are, the better off they probably will be. And I don't mean formal education...just voracious reading about lots of topics provides an education and/or having a curiosity about our Universe.

But the key in this discussion about parents and their involvement and education, is that these parents will never be created equal...they will range from drug-addicts and poverty to doctors and millionaires so there is no way possible to count on anything consistent from parents. This is why I boiled it down to just three things that most all parents can provide.

Also, like I originally stated, what is the mission of public education?? Is it to create certain types of US citizens? Is it to prepare kids for the workplace? Is it for baby-sitting while parents work or play? Why is it mandatory and not optional? To answer these questions, or even guess at the answers, one must be able to step back to the edge of space and take a real wide look at the program. To be honest, I don't even know the mission of the public education program--do you??

__________________
Did you know both our problems and the solutions can be found simply by looking in our mirrors...and...Never confuse the extraordinary stuff I think and write with that of a well-balanced person...

OldManOnFire

If you look along the top edge of the box when you type responses, there is a row of icons; B...I...U...and so on and if you go across you will find one that places a quote around selected text...it's a square box with text inside. Just highlight or select the text and then click on this icon...

__________________
Did you know both our problems and the solutions can be found simply by looking in our mirrors...and...Never confuse the extraordinary stuff I think and write with that of a well-balanced person...