Hate is the underpinning of the "modern" Republican Party - Page 11

BillCosby · 01-07-2008, 10:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kanadesaga

This is all very interesting. No sarcasm intended. My statements about man and war I believe are accurate. Why? Becuase I think man is warlike, because it is a solution that has worked before and will work again. It was our violence that probably ended the Neadrathals. Competition for resources led not to a collaboration by ancient peoples but rather violence. Because it was they easy way to get what you wanted.

Can man rise above it? Of course he can. I agree with Brainpolice about the Hobbsian view I gave. Look at such institutions the UN, Articles of Confederation or even the Iroquios Confederacy. They all try to provide for the common good and common defence. and they all did a rather good job for what they do. (NO< I do not want to get into a discussion about the Articles right now)

My point is I guess, that it is always the easy way humans take, and the easy way is war.

Howard Zinn.......

Quote:

When you look at the endless series of wars of this century you do not find a public demanding war, but rather resisting it, until citizens are bombarded with exhortations that appeal, not to a killer instinct, but to a desire to do good, to spread democracy or liberty or overthrow a tyrant.

Brainpolice · 01-07-2008, 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jonesy

Dawn might be right..... me vs. you, you lose, but maybe my brain is satisfied?

A problem I have with the "conflict is inevitable" view is that it assumes that everything is a zero-sum game. But this is not so. Economics is not a zero-sum game where it is only possible for one person to benefit at the expense of another. The entire basis of voluntary exchange (and "society" to me is just voluntary cooperation and exchange) is that both people benefit in some way ex ante and ex post. Resources are scarce, yes, but the batch of things extracted from those resources is constantly changing in size and scope. It is a dynamic process.

Kanadesaga · 01-07-2008, 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jonesy

Dawn might be right..... me vs. you, you lose, but maybe my brain is satisfied?

You may be a little premature in declaring victory there pal. Perhaps not an uncommon experience?

Kanadesaga · 01-07-2008, 09:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dawnling

If we eliminate the practice and idea of
'war',
we do not eliminate human
fierceness.

Sports are an effective and lucrative outlet
for this fierceness

No argument, but shall we take it to gladitorial levels? Man is blood thirsty. Look at his "sports": hunting, bullfighting, and the indescribable atrocities committed on animals of all species in the name of human entertainment..

Kanadesaga · 01-07-2008, 10:20 PM

When you look at the endless series of wars of this century you do not find a public demanding war, but rather resisting it, until citizens are bombarded with exhortations that appeal, not to a killer instinct, but to a desire to do good, to spread democracy or liberty or overthrow a tyrant. Howard Zinn

while I would hate to disagree with Zinn, but why does the appeal to do good always involve death.....and profit.

BillCosby · 01-08-2008, 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kanadesaga

When you look at the endless series of wars of this century you do not find a public demanding war, but rather resisting it, until citizens are bombarded with exhortations that appeal, not to a killer instinct, but to a desire to do good, to spread democracy or liberty or overthrow a tyrant. Howard Zinn

while I would hate to disagree with Zinn, but why does the appeal to do good always involve death.....and profit.

I agree w/ much of what Howard says but have a bit of trouble w/ the "desire to do good" aspect as well.......... I do not share his rosy view of humanity although I do agree that ppl are coerced/tricked & lied to in order for them to go to war & kill ppl they don't even know.......

Kanadesaga · 01-08-2008, 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillCosby

I agree w/ much of what Howard says but have a bit of trouble w/ the "desire to do good" aspect as well.......... I do not share his rosy view of humanity although I do agree that ppl are coerced/tricked & lied to in order for them to go to war & kill ppl they don't even know.......

I think people are lazy. If "good" accomplishes their goal, they'll go with it. If it takes war, we seem all too eager to go along with it. Look at Iraq, how many supported it on March 20, 2003? Without a clue a lot of them.

BillCosby · 01-08-2008, 01:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kanadesaga

I think people are lazy. If "good" accomplishes their goal, they'll go with it. If it takes war, we seem all too eager to go along with it. Look at Iraq, how many supported it on March 20, 2003? Without a clue a lot of them.

lol... Yea where laZy........... I am here doing this & should be outside in the drizzle racking up the redwood debris all over my front yard.......

I don't see it that ppl were ready to run off to Opiumstan or IraQ........ We got sold..........

In the media as well as by our government.. Not just the white house but the congress as well..... SOLD A HUGE ASS BILL OF GOODS. BAD GOODS.... Which we took.. Hook. Line & sinker............

These ppl know what they are doing.. slow build up & we don't even realize it @ the time......... Looking back it is pretty clear.........

Initially we weren't going into OPiumstan........

Initially we were not going into IraQ......

BUt somehow a good portion of the American ppl came to believe many if not all the 9/11 ppl were from Opiumstan & IraQ......

Not one was from either........

We were blasted daily in the bad press about bin laden, eventhough he has yet to be charged w/ a crime to this day.........

Then suddenly his face began to rapidly fade to the back pages & sadaam took center stage.. Day in & day out our media rilled us up w/ the man that was evil incarnate........

Now they are doing the same w/ Syria, Iran, Palestinians. ANyone that opposes American interest are subject..........

It was no accident... The media willingly played along...............

Kanadesaga · 01-08-2008, 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillCosby

lol... Yea where laZy........... I am here doing this & should be outside in the drizzle racking up the redwood debris all over my front yard.......

I don't see it that ppl were ready to run off to Opiumstan or IraQ........ We got sold..........

In the media as well as by our government.. Not just the white house but the congress as well..... SOLD A HUGE ASS BILL OF GOODS. BAD GOODS.... Which we took.. Hook. Line & sinker............

These ppl know what they are doing.. slow build up & we don't even realize it @ the time......... Looking back it is pretty clear.........

Initially we weren't going into OPiumstan........

Initially we were not going into IraQ......

BUt somehow a good portion of the American ppl came to believe many if not all the 9/11 ppl were from Opiumstan & IraQ......

Not one was from either........

We were blasted daily in the bad press about bin laden, eventhough he has yet to be charged w/ a crime to this day.........

Then suddenly his face began to rapidly fade to the back pages & sadaam took center stage.. Day in & day out our media rilled us up w/ the man that was evil incarnate........

Now they are doing the same w/ Syria, Iran, Palestinians. ANyone that opposes American interest are subject..........

It was no accident... The media willingly played along...............

Agreed and agreed. the fourth Estate failed this country miserably.
Some I think were caught up in the moment. Others did this purposefully. and we know who they are don't we Roger Alles.

01-07-2008, 10:20 PM	#105 (permalink)
Kanadesaga Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: NYS - Devil's country Posts: 7,080 My Mood: Blog Entries: 6 Thanks: 232 Thanked 93 Times in 67 Posts	When you look at the endless series of wars of this century you do not find a public demanding war, but rather resisting it, until citizens are bombarded with exhortations that appeal, not to a killer instinct, but to a desire to do good, to spread democracy or liberty or overthrow a tyrant. Howard Zinn while I would hate to disagree with Zinn, but why does the appeal to do good always involve death.....and profit. __________________ Bill has the Blues Saturdays 10 pm to Midnight est www.whws.fm Thanksgiving Show 9pm to 1 am
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