Curator

And Jesus was just a carpenter. No more...no less.

He was born of a virgin, he performed miracles, he endured torture beyond human endurance, he was nailed to a cross and had committed no crime, his birth, death and Resurrection were prophesied, he was transfigured, walked on water, rose from the dead, he visited with the apostles and many others after his resurrection.

And all of this is proven how?

Proven by the "written" word of man in a centuries old book.

These true believers, believe in nothing more than the written word of man.

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"Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies."
- Groucho Marx

"I am not opposed to all wars. I'm opposed to dumb wars."
-Barack Obama, October 2002

Environment Man

The universe did not happen by chance. The structure of DNA and the atom did not happen by chance. The laws of physics did not self establish without sentience. Jesus was the son of God who created the aforementioned 'miracles of chance' that you seem to promote.

LeisureChrist

"Had to be" There is no way to impose a "had to be" on the omnipotent.

LeisureChrist

I'm sure you mean that Heracles was the son of Zeus. Much less imaginary than your "gods."

Environment Man

Jesus HAD TO BE obedient to God in order to remain in allegiance with God or even to exist. As we MUST be. It is not an option.

Environment Man

Well you are unwashed and insist on dirtying up Jesus and God. I have a wash cloth for you but you refuse to use it.

LeisureChrist

You misunderstand. But I'm used to that. The "had to be" I was referring to was there being any sort of condition or requirement that must be met in order for an omnipotent God to forgive our sins should he choose to do so. For that matter, should he choose not to, he cannot be required to, no matter what sacrifice might be made unto him. Somply put, any limits or rules to which God must bow belies the idea of him being omnipotent. I do have an idea of loophole that might explain how such a sacrifice might be necessary without compromising God's omnipotence, if you'd like to hear it.

LeisureChrist

that I am capable of dirtying them should tell you something about their worth as objects of worship...

Environment Man

Again you misunderstand the nature of God. Anything he does IS perfect. The way he chose WAS perfect. And it is also logical justice. A perfect sacrifice for a perfect sin. God is a God of justice and justice eminates from him. So it is HIS own requirement that justice should have been served the way it was. And to test the loyalty of his son.

Environment Man

Well YOU cannot dirty THEM. Your actions only dirty you in their eyes. They offer you cleanliness but you wallow in your free will preferring dirtiness.