Hillary Clinton's First Test Likely in Gaza

[Teri B.]

Hillary Clinton's First Test Likely in Gaza

New Top Diplomat Brings Star Power to Arab-Israeli Conflict, but Is That Enough?
By RUSSELL GOLDMAN
Dec. 31, 2008—


About to encounter a world of problems, including two ongoing wars, the first matter Secretary of State-designate Hillary Clinton will likely have to address is the hottest -- the escalated fighting between Israel and Hamas militants in Gaza.

While Clinton brings to the table of any future Mideast peace negotiations a respected name and the goodwill surrounding her boss Barack Obama -- and her husband, former President Bill Clinton -- she also brings a legacy of contradictory statements about the region.

Since Hamas, the Islamist organization branded a terror group by the United States, violated a ceasefire and then, five days ago, Israel began responding with precision air strikes, President-elect Obama and Clinton have both refused to comment on the fighting, leading many to wonder where the new administration stands on the conflict.

Clinton, who, when running against Obama for the Democratic nomination, criticized Obama for his lack of foreign policy experience, has also been lambasted for her own lack of credentials, and over the course of nearly 20 years in the national spotlight has made a series of contradictory statements about the Arab-Israeli conflict.

Departing from her then-president husband's position and what was then longstanding U.S. policy, Hillary Clinton in 1998 called for the establishment of an independent Palestinian state, a remark the White House later stepped back from. She again took flak from pro-Israel groups when, in 2000, she kissed Souha Arafat, the wife of then-Palestinian Authority President Yasser Arafat.

But since becoming the junior senator from New York in 2000, and in running this year for president, Clinton has avowed a staunchly pro-Israel position, telling ABC News that if Iran attacked Israel, the United States would "totally obliterate" it.

"Israelis and Palestinians know Bill Clinton and they know Hillary Clinton," said David Makovsky, senior fellow at the Washington Institute for Near East Policy. "The Palestinians remember her embracing Arafat's wife Souha, the Israelis remember her as the senator from New York who threatened Iran."


'A Mixed Legacy' in the Region
Having taken both pro-Palestinian positions and pro-Israeli positions may, in fact, strengthen her position as a diplomat and negotiator, rather than hurt it, said Tamara Wittes, a Brookings Institute fellow who specializes in the Arab-Israeli peace process.

"It is a mixed legacy that could serve her well on both sides," Wittes said.

"As first lady she split with her husband and made some pretty controversial comments. As senator from New York and on the campaign she was avowedly pro-Israel. There is fodder there for both optimists and pessimists from both sides," she said.

Clinton also brings to the table her name and the legacy of her husband's work to make peace.

"Her husband is warmly remembered by both Israelis and Palestinians as someone who understood their concerns and desires," Wittes said. "His efforts ultimately failed at the end of his presidency, but he received credit from both sides. He's probably the only person in the world who could get elected in Israel or the Palestinian territories."

But the conflict of 2008 is very different from where Bill Clinton left things in 2000, said retired Gen. Anthony Zinni, the former special envoy to Israel and the Palestinian Authority.

"Clinton and Obama are faced with an entirely different game," Zinni said. "There are no strong leaders on either side. Leaders in both places are in trouble with their own constituencies and are weak."

The conflict Obama and Hillary Clinton will encounter differs vastly from the one President Clinton came close to resolving in the waning days of his presidency in 2000. Since then, Arafat has died and the Palestinians have become increasingly fractured, with Arafat's secular Fattah party, which governs the West Bank, sometimes openly warring with the Islamist Hamas, which rules Gaza.

While the politics throughout the Middle East, not just in Israel and the Palestinian territories, complicate Clinton's job, the politics in Washington -- particularly the election of Obama -- could make it easier.



Expectations for Obama
"Obama brings both a lot of hope and high expectations throughout the Arab world," Zinni said. "There are such negative views of the current administration, that he can almost be guaranteed to get more cooperation and more willingness to listen. Beyond just representing a change, though, he has to really make a change -- change his approach and commit to a real process."

The possibility of a cease-fire emerged late Tuesday as Israel and Hamas continued to trade blows and the death toll rose to more than 350 with more than 1,400 injured.

Speaking at a special session of parliament Monday, Israeli Defense Minister Ehud Barak said the country is engaged in a "war to the bitter end" against Hamas in Gaza, but he declined to give details of how far that war would go to stop Hamas rocket attacks.

Barak is a candidate for prime minister in Israel's election, scheduled for February. Former Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, the current front-runner, hinted at a broader campaign to end Hamas' rule in Gaza.

Netanyahu told Reuters that a government under his leadership would use "all means necessary" to end Hamas' rule in Gaza.

ABC News: Hillary Clinton's First Test Likely in Gaza

[Teri B.]

This situation is REALLY, REALLY weighing heavily on my mind, for so many reasons. The GD killing and destruction is mind boggling. Israel has had Gaza under seige for over a year already, starving those people, and denying them so many necessities, and now this!

On NPR, the guy who came in 2nd for Palestinian president, says that Israel started this, by frequently firing into Gaza during the cease fire, like they were trying to get a reaction from Hamas.

Is Israel TRYING to start WWIII? Egypt is going to drawn into this, then all bets are off.

How can Israel, after what was done to them as a people, keep doing this?!? DAMMIT!

(And don't y'all start your mindless Hillary hating or I'm going to kick some ass! )

[Heretic]

This situation is REALLY, REALLY weighing heavily on my mind, for so many reasons. The GD killing and destruction is mind boggling. Israel has had Gaza under seige for over a year already, starving those people, and denying them so many necessities, and now this!

The suffication of Palestinians isn't a yer old it's forty years old.

Not to beat a dead horse, but this is yet another issue on which Hillary's said whatever it took to get ahead in elections. The fact she'll be in charge of the diplomacy means the Israeli government will do fine.

But the Palestinians are going to continue getting fucked over and murdered for it.

On NPR, the guy who came in 2nd for Palestinian president, says that Israel started this, by frequently firing into Gaza during the cease fire, like they were trying to get a reaction from Hamas.

The concept is to create justification for stealing what little is left of BOTH the Gaza Strip and the West Bank. They know Hamas are predictable enough to goad into more terrorism at the slightest provocation [or not at all on occasion] and the Israeli government hardliners deliberately conflate innocent Palestinians with the terror groups.

Is Israel TRYING to start WWIII? Egypt is going to drawn into this, then all bets are off.

No, the Egyptian government has learned their lesson. They go grudgingly along with it because they can't win against Israel's military blank check from the U.S. and the additional aid and intelligence information [often info about internal dissent] we send to Egypt itself.

How can Israel, after what was done to them as a people, keep doing this?!? DAMMIT!

Imperialism is a socio-political form of vampirism. The last victim becoems the next perp.

(And don't y'all start your mindless Hillary hating or I'm going to kick some ass! )

If it were just Hillary that'd be something. Truth is the whole of our government has been turning a blind eye to ethnic cleansing and the liteny of other crimes against humanity the Israeli government has perpetrated against the innocent Palestinians not associated with terrorism. [I have to underline those things so dumb people don't accuse me of anti-semitism or cheering on Hamas.]

Hey, maybe Hamas'll get lucky and the IDF will stupidly throw another special forces team in for them to gun down in the streets, the way they did in Beirut last year.

Won't help the Palestinians much, though.

[CosmicRocker]

Hamas overthru The Palestinian Authority, because they were corrupt.

Now Hamas is JUST as corrupt - but they are a terrorist organization wanting to " drive Israel into the sea"


Same old radical arab rhetoric - but now they are supplied via tunnels from Lebanon's Hezbollah, which is supplied by Iran.

So once again Iran has it's hands bloodied with terroristic blood.

Not much to " negotiate " when your adversary are fanatics who don't care about the destruction of Gaza - only dedicated to shooting rockets into Israel.

It's gonna take an Isareli land movement into Gaza, to clean the place out - and try at least to set up a legitimate government.

Don't look or help from Egypt. Lebanon, Syria - too cowardly to go against the radicals in their own country.


Let's be clear - this was started by Hamas, and Hamas bears the responsibility of what happens.

[Environment Man]

Happy New Year Cos.

Where you been man?

[CosmicRocker]

Happy New Year Cos.

Where you been man?

same to you.

Lots of overtime over the Holidays, I haven't had a day off since before Xmas.

Also -I try to keep up at Rumbleville - but again - working is eating my time up.

Challenge me to a game if you wish.

[Heretic]

Hamas overthru The Palestinian Authority, because they were corrupt.

It's not an overthrow is the election is clean and fair. Another of Jr.'s many blunders.

Now Hamas is JUST as corrupt - but they are a terrorist organization wanting to " drive Israel into the sea"

Just as the Israeli government wants to stomp Palestine in historical dust.

Same old radical arab rhetoric - but now they are supplied via tunnels from Lebanon's Hezbollah, which is supplied by Iran.

Yes, yes, just as we supply Israel. it's a proxy chessboard fight between other nations too subversive chickenshit to scrap it out directly.

So once again Iran has it's hands bloodied with terroristic blood.

Just as ours are stained with innocent Palestinians. This is our hands are dirtier than Iran's based on the noncom bodycount.

Not much to " negotiate " when your adversary are fanatics who don't care about the destruction of Gaza - only dedicated to shooting rockets into Israel.

The bugger of it is the feeling is mutual, and not just toward the terrorist groups

It's gonna take an Isareli land movement into Gaza, to clean the place out - and try at least to set up a legitimate government.

The Israeli government's objective of "cleaning up" means pushing all Palestinians out not just Hamas.

Don't look or help from Egypt. Lebanon, Syria - too cowardly to go against the radicals in their own country.

Cowardice is bombing civilians from 30,000 feet up simply because they're unfortunate enough to be within half a mile of a Hamas safehouse that even a blind man could find with his cane.

Let's be clear - this was started by Hamas, and Hamas bears the responsibility of what happens.

Actually no, this time it was assassinations that goaded Hamas into this. To be clear Hamas should just stop the violence, but they're not the sole cause of killing.

[CosmicRocker]

well now we got us a real mess.
A genuine land war between Israel who cannot accept daily rocket barrages,
and Gaza that is already so unlivable, civilians are gonna die from combat, and lack of food and water.


Of course the other Arab state will sit bye and condem Israek - but not say a word about the 100's of rockets set off ever day by Hamas.

Fuck 'em. Israel didn't start this - Hamas broke the cese fire.
Go in there and root them out.

They are a continuing threat to stability.
They will never accept Isael as legitimate.

[Teri B.]

Let's be clear - this was started by Hamas, and Hamas bears the responsibility of what happens.

Oh bull crap! After WWII, we told the Palestinians to hit the road because there were new owners in town who "God" gave the land to, and it's been a cluster fuck ever since. Yeah, they're holding a grudge. I might do the same if I were in their shoes. I'm not justifying terrorism, nor Israel's shameful treatment of these people. Both sides are wrong, and both sides have blood on their hands.

What's it REALLY going to take for Israel to have peace in that region? The Jewish people are the biggest victims in history. But, now it's like a person who's had severe poison ivy, insisting on sleeping in poison ivy. I don't know why the hell we're blaming the poison ivy just for being.

[Heretic]

well now we got us a real mess.
A genuine land war between Israel who cannot accept daily rocket barrages,
and Gaza that is already so unlivable, civilians are gonna die from combat, and lack of food and water.


Of course the other Arab state will sit bye and condem Israek - but not say a word about the 100's of rockets set off ever day by Hamas.

Fuck 'em. Israel didn't start this - Hamas broke the cese fire.
Go in there and root them out.

They are a continuing threat to stability.
They will never accept Isael as legitimate.

There hasn't been a hundred rockets total fired from Gaza. It was a total of eighty as of yesterday. It should be ZERO but then again since when is it right to avenge five deaths by killing five hundred innocent victims in turn?