Should the Patriots have an asterisk in the record book?

mudwhistle · 12-04-2007, 07:43 AM

New England is 12-0 now. If they win four more games they become the first team since the NFL went to a sixteen game season to go undefeated. But they got caught cheating in the beginning of the season. So if they do go undefeated, should that record have a * next to it since they cheated? I say yes.

Teri B. · 12-04-2007, 08:31 AM

Here in Hoover, Alabama, we have the best high school team in the nation, and they got caught cheating and had to forfiet a game. THAT'S HOW CHEATERS ARE DEALT WITH! What the HELL happened to sportsmanship being prized in sports?

I agree with this guy, who echos what Chris Collingsworth said on Inside the NFL a few weeks ago:

Quote:

Belichick Spygate Scandal:
Unanswered Questions

I read an article in the paper this morning claiming that NFL Commissioner Roger Goodall had destroyed the videotapes in question. What the ....!!? Is anyone besides me outraged by that? Does anyone care? Maybe not. Maybe cheating is now perfectly acceptable -- as long as everyone involved is making money.

First the facts that we do know.

An employee of the New England Patriots was caught on the Patriots sideline videotaping defensive signals, by opposing New York Jets coaches, in their first game of the NFL season. A review of the tape by the NFL confirmed this.

Of course, taping opposing teams signals would have allowed the Patriots, after reviewing the tape, to know exactly what the signal was for a particular defensive call. Later, when they see that signal again -- they know the play the other team will run. Simple. And, very useful information to have. Unfortunately for the Patriots -- it is illegal!

There also were some “radio frequency issues” that occurred during the game; however, those issues appear to have not been pursued by the NFL. More about the radio frequency issues later.

After reviewing the matter, NFL Commissioner Roger Goodall stated:

This episode represents a calculated and deliberate attempt to avoid longstanding rules designed to encourage fair play and promote honest competition on the playing field.

Goodall imposed the following punishments:

Fined Bill Belichick $500,000

Fined the Patriots $250,000

Took away the Pat's first round draft pick in the 2008 NFL draft (or their 2nd and 3rd round picks if they don't make the playoffs).

Bill Belichick's response to all this has been essentially as follows:

I accept full responsibility (no indication what that means)

My interpretation of a rule in the [NFL's] Constitution and Bylaws was incorrect.

I will not be offering any further comment on this matter

With that, Bill Belichick would like us all to go on about our business and not further trouble him with this matter.

Clearly, the NFL is of the same mind. Have you seen Roger Goodall discussing the scandal? Didn’t think so.

Unfortunately for the NFL and Mr. Belichick there are serious outstanding issues that demand further inquiry.

First, it should be understood that there is no possible “issue” (or defense) of "an incorrect interpretation" as Belichick infers in his statement.

Page 105 of the NFL's "Game Operations Manual" states:

"No video recording devices of any kind are permitted to be in use in the coaches' booth, on the field, or in the locker room during the game."

That's a pretty clear-cut rule.

But, if he were talking (which he is not) maybe Belichick would say he didn't intentionally violate NFL rules because he never really read the NFL rule book in detail.

That's hard to imagine since he's been coaching in the NFL for over 3 decades, and reputedly is a genius. But, I guess it could be a possible, even if unlikely, defense.

The trouble (for Bill) is that we have a "smoking gun."

On September 6, 2006, NFL Executive Vice President of Football Operations, Ray Anderson, sent a letter to NFL head coaches (including Bill Belichick) stating:

"Video taping of any type, including but not limited to taping of an opponent’s offensive or defensive signals, is prohibited on the sidelines, in the coaches’ booth, in the locker room, or at any other locations accessible to club staff members during the game."

So, there is no doubt that Bill Belichick not only violated the rules, but that he also did it knowingly and willfully.

Not only that, but from the facts we the public have available to us, it appears clear that this is not the first time, in Belichicks tenure, the Patriots have cheated during a football game.

In fact, every day, new stories of prior Patriot misdeeds seem to come to light. Some of those include:

Former Patriots' offensive coach, Charlie Weis, overheard congratulating Tampa Bay’s defensive coordinator, Monte Kiffin, allegedly stating: "We knew all your calls, and you still stopped us. I can't believe it."

A separate Patriot taping incident during a game with the Detroit Lions.

Pittsburg Steeler’s players saying when they played the Patriots, somehow, the Pats knew all the Steeler plays before they were run.

Patriots jamming signals to the headphones of opposing coaches.

Perhaps the strongest evidence this cheating has gone on for years is that Belichick apparently only got caught this time because someone, who knows how he does business, ratted him out.

That person was Jets Head Coach, Eric Mangini.

Mangini was an assistant coach for the Patriots until January 2006 when he was hired by the Jets. Rumor has it that the Jets-Patriots games last year were full of intrigue as the Jets coaches, knowing they were being taped by the Patriots, mixed up fake signals with real ones.

But, preparing for NFL game days is tough enough without having to learn 2 or 3 times as many signals as usual and memorizing which are fake and with are real.

Apparently, Mangini got sick of the nonsense and alerted NFL security about what to expect from a certain Patriot cameraman. The rest is history.

Maybe now we have a better understanding for why Belichick was strangely upset at Mangini for taking the Jets head coaching job. Traditionally, coaches are happy for a subordinate who gets a shot at the head job somewhere. Not Belichick. Hmmm.

Oh, by the way, Mangini was asked if this cheating went on when he was an assistant coach at New England. Mangini said he had no comment. Hmmm.

As "Spygate" continues to unfold, it appears increasingly likely that cheating has been the way the Bill Belichick and the Patriots have done business for years.

Hey Bill, if it isn’t so – say so. Tell us exactly when your cheating began. Oh yea, that's right, you said you will have no comment on this matter.

Sorry Mr. Belichick, but your silence speaks volumes. In fact, it is deafening.

As bad as Belichick’s cheating is, that is not even the big story here. The more significant problem has been the NFL’s response. The NFL’s response has been so tepid and weak that it makes you wonder why they are afraid to dig more deeply. It calls into question the integrity of the game.

If there was an allegation that a college football coach was intentionally cheating; stealing signals from the other team; you can be sure there would be a full investigation.

The first question that would be asked; the first question anyone would ask is:

HAVE YOU DONE THIS BEFORE?

Roger Goodall, and the NFL don’t seem interested in asking that, most obvious, of questions. Why?

Because, they know the answer already. And they don’t like it.

The answer is – "heck yea, we cheated before!"

Based on the evidence in the public record today, it seems quite likely that Belichick and the Patriots have been cheating for years.

It is more troubling because the cheating apparently paid off. Bill Belichick is the only coach in NFL history to win 3 Super Bowls in 4 years. He is (maybe was) headed for the Pro Football Hall of Fame.

Each one of the Patriot Super Bowl victories were in extremely close games (3 point margin in each).

Could knowing the other teams signals (or interrupting their electronic communications) have made a difference in the outcome. You betcha.

Every one of the Patriots' Super Bowls Championships is tarnished. That goes for their AFC Championships too.

And what about Tom Brady? No one has talked about him yet in connection with this scandal. He has an image of being such a clutch quarterback. Always making the right throw to the open receiver at the key moment? Did that happen because he was apparently the beneficiary of stolen information? It's a lot easier to beat a safety blitz when you know it's coming before the ball is snapped.

OK, assuming the NFL did an investigation (which they are unlikely to do) and confirmed that the Patriots cheating has been going on for years; what should be the appropriate punishment?

Actually, that’s easy.

If they cheated, their wins should be forfeited. Any first grader knows that.

Heck, the NCAA regularly erases wins from prior seasons, if it is proven, for instance, that a booster (with the knowledge of the football program) improperly allowed a football player to drive a car for free.

In this case, we have an NFL head coach, knowingly, intentionally cheating during a regular season football game. Caught red-handed. Videotaped evidence for Pete's sake!

The NFL’s response? First, they do not inquire into prior misconduct.

Second, to put the current issue to bed, they quickly dish out punishment that seems tough, but actually is essentially nothing.

A $500,000 fine seems rough to you and I. To Bill Belichick, it really means nothing.

Belichick has a base salary of $5 million a year. Who knows how much more he makes on speaking engagements, endorsements, etc.

When you make that kind of money (and have for a number of years), it’s hard to understand why another $500,000 would matter much to you.

As for the draft pick, the Patriots already have 2 first round picks (got one from a trade with San Francisco). And Goodall didn’t even take pick likely to be higher in the first round (the one the Pat’s got from San Francisco).

The goal of the NFL, and Roger Goodall, is the same goal as Bill Belichick's – to make this whole ugly thing go away quickly.

As an aside, one unintended consequence of Spygate is that the NFL is doing wonders for the reputation of the NCAA’s rule enforcement division. In comparison to the NFL, the NCAA will now be viewed as the "tough cops" in the world of athletic rules enforcement.

Well, let's hope someone out there is listening. It will be horribly unjust if Bill Belichick is allowed to walk away from this without ever having to come clean.

Mr. Belichick, if you ever read this, I hope you will consider coming clean and telling all. If the truth is that you did cheat to win those Super Bowls, we can forgive you for that.

Mind you, the games will still need to be forfeited. But, we are a forgiving Nation and we can forgive you – if you tell the truth.

If the truth is that this was the first time you cheated, tell us that. Answer our questions and we will judge based on the evidence.

If you continue to stonewall on this issue, it is only reasonable that we assume the worst.

The obvious, until now, unasked and unanswered, question for you is simply: Have you done this before?

If your answer to this question is along the lines of: "What do you mean?" Or, "Define the word ‘this’" – then you will need to answer the following additional questions:

Who videotaped the Jets signals in your first game this season?

Who told him to do that?

Did you know the Jets signals were to be videotaped by Patriots personnel?

How did you know that?

Has anyone from the Patriots organization ever before taped the signals of opposing teams during games?

When?

Have you (or to you knowledge other Patriot personnel) ever viewed game videotape of opposing team signals?

When?

Why?

How was the tape obtained?

For what purpose was the tape obtained?

For what purpose did you use the information gained?

Specifically, in preparation for playoff games, including the Patriots three Super Bowl appearances, did you (or to your knowledge other Patriot personnel) view game videotape of opposing team signals?

Mr. Belichick: Those are the questions. Please use the form below to submit your answers to the football world.

Mr. Goodall: You should feel free to use the above questions, should you decide to end the whitewash and conduct a thorough investigation of Mr. Belichick’s cheating.

To me, it's not even so much that Belichick and the Patriots cheated. I'm sure there are others in the NFL who have done similar things. Of course, no one has done it as much or as successfully (till now) as the Patriots.

But, the real kicker is that, even though caught red-handed, it appears Belichick will be allowed to walk away without even answering the real questions about his misconduct.

Let's not let that happen. Speak out if you think Belichick should have to explain what the Patriots did. Or if you don't. Either way, tell the football world what you think by using the form below. Thanks.

http://www.secsportsfan.com/belichic...e-scandal.html

mudwhistle · 12-29-2007, 09:26 PM

Good article and bump for more votes.

cronincal · 12-29-2007, 09:30 PM

except for the fact voting is closed.

VKMHVM2 · 12-29-2007, 09:39 PM

No. Congratulations to Bill Belichick and the New England Patriots on the first ever 16-0 undefeated regular season. My Giants gave them a scare, but the better team and the better coached team won.

JeffinCO · 12-29-2007, 09:43 PM

It does stink.

...and Belichick's answer to the charges only reinforces the suspicion against him as the head coach actually ordering this to be done.

Shake · 12-30-2007, 03:54 AM

Bullshit. The NFL can't deal with the fact that, despite their attempts at parity, they have a team that is clearly superior. 'Spygate' is that fat tub of lard Mangini trying to explain why he can't beat New England. Nobody will unless Dungy coaches the game of his life. I can't wait until the '72 Dolphins are joined in perfection by a superior squad and Peyton Manning falls off the face f the Earth because he is an overrated piece of shit who only wins when the NFL rigs the rules 5 years straight.

Sean · 12-30-2007, 06:47 AM

With the digital cameras used they zoomed in on the play-books the coaches use in particular situations, these are broken down as options such as 1st and 10, 1st and 15, 1st and 20 and so on through all options you could possibly have throughout an entire game first to fourth quarter and then overtime. Also in detailed video recorded study were the nuances of regimen used by coaching and training staff along the sideline as well as players. Special tapes were made of only audio from those videos; including the different nuances of voice inflection during snap counts and broke those down to show a repetitive pattern throughout game situations as well. Using all of this to prepare for a team leaves the other team with little up it's sleeve. When you are watching them up-close through a digital camera during a game while making new recordings and have all of the previous information recorded you do indeed have one Hell of an advantage.

There's a lot more to it than the above but the NFL swept this under the rug for many reasons one of which is to avoid the disgrace, another big reason is that if there were an investigation most teams would be found guilty. Or so the commissioner says.

I'm with Chris Collinsworth (very rare of me to agree with this man entirely) and Bob Costas in that the Pats Bowl Championships should be stripped or asterisk by them.

disfigured · 12-30-2007, 06:58 AM

7 minutes of tape that was attained illegally but was never used is hardly a reason to have an asterisk for this season.

The fact of the matter is, when your ontop as high as the Pats are there's always going to be detractors.

They simply are the better team, probably the best that's ever been, and they are certainly lead by one the the greatest QB's to ever play the game.

Sean · 12-30-2007, 07:08 AM

Bull shit! They've been doing this for years, not seven minutes. They are fucking cheaters and should not be allowed to play in the play offs. They simply look better due to cheating. The NFL swept this scandal under the rug and you took that seven minute bait.

View Poll Results: Should New England get an asterisk in the record book?
Yes	2	66.67%
No	1	33.33%
Voters: 3. You may not vote on this poll

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